Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Seattle or Bust
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Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Seattle or Bust » Tue May 21, 2024 6:45 pm

Looking at the current standings, I believe the current clear sellers are the White Sox, Angels, A's, Marlins, Reds, and Rockies.

Teams like the Cardinals, Pirates, Diamondbacks, Mets, Nationals, Giants and Blue Jays may become sellers depending on how the next month unfolds... but a lot of those teams have invested in competing this year and will likely ride it out until they no longer can.

This list assumes that young, cheap, controlled position players are off limits. So players like Otto Lopez, etc... are excluded from this list.

White Sox:

OF Tommy Pham - as embarrassing as it is that a team might have to trade for a player who they could have easily signed early in the season when Canzone went down, the M's would have to do that if they traded for Pham. He's been the lone bright spot for the White Sox since joining the squad in mid April. He's currently holding down an impressive .314/.359/.453/.812 slash. The M's could certainly use more lefty bats in their lineup, especially one who is more contact-centered. He's K'd just 14 times in 92 AB's this season.

OF Luis Robert Jr. - there's no denying that Robert is a very talented player. However, acquiring him comes with 3 major sticking points: 1. He's always injured. 2. You'd have to move him off CF to RF which diminishes his value... because while his bat his great, it's not the elite of the elite and his value mostly lies in his ability to play center. 3. It's going to cost you a ton in prospects to buy a corner OF. The upside for Robert is high. He's going to hit 40 homers and he'll be a very marketable player... issue is he K's just as much as Julio, never walks, and has been prone to the down season with a bat. A very big risk/reward trade if it happened.

RHP Steven Wilson - Wilson was traded from the Padres to the White Sox in the Dylan Cease blockbuster. He's in his 3rd year in the bigs and has pitched to some decent numbers... has a career 3.38 ERA despite some lofty FIPS. He's currently rocking a 2.84 ERA but 6.26 FIP for the White Sox which has to be one of the most insane stat lines in baseball. His style has to tickle the M's fancy... he's a sweeper heavy pitcher who touches 96 on the 4 seemer... sort of reminds me of a combo of Brash/Sewald with the arm angle and the way his pitches ride. I'd be surprised if he's not on their radar.

RHP Michael Kopech - It's almost a guarantee that Kopech will be traded as he'll be a free agent in 2025. Kopech has never quite reached his lofty pedigree but the right hander throws hard and continually sports an ERA in the mid 3's as a reliever. He would seem an ideal Brash replacement as a pure rental.

Angels:

OF Taylor Ward - I'm not sure the Angels would trade anyone to the M's, let alone Taylor Ward... but it's worth exploring. Despite the superstars falling all around him, Ward has been one of the lone bright spots for the Angels and has been for a number of years. He's currently slashing .281/.325/.492/.817 with 10 homers. Despite being 30 and not becoming a free agent until 2027, Ward is making $4.8 million in arbitration and will only get more expensive. The Angels really should begin a rebuild and trading him would net a nice return.

OF Kevin Pillar - Similar to Pham, the M's could have had him if they wanted him. He was DFA'd by the White Sox earlier in the year and has come back with a vengeance for the Angels slashing .442/.467/.744/1.211 with 3 homers, 2 doubles, and a triple in 13 games. Time will tell if this is a fluke, but the Angels would sure love it if signing him led to a nice return near the deadline.

RHP Carson Fulmer/RHP Hunter Strickland - The Angels have become the land of players getting a renaissance year. Both Fulmer and Strickland are on record saying they thought they were going to be out of the league before the Angels came calling. To both their credits, they've pitched to ERA's in the low 2's so far in 2024 and would be nice low leverage, depth pieces to add to the bullpen.

A's:

Util Abraham Toro - Makes me want to puke. I hate to say it, but Toro has been great with the A's in '24. He's slashing .295/.346/.446/.792... basically has been Josh Rojas. I don't want it but I would understand it. Fucker has a 130 OPS+...

OF Brent Rooker - If I had my choice, this is who I would go after. To me, Rooker is who Mitch Haniger used to be. I don't think Haniger is long for being a Mariner and I think the M's will have to eventually choose to just eat that contract. Rooker is slowly giving superstar vibes at the age of 29 despite this only being his second serious year in the league. He's slashing .281/.358/.578/.935 with 11 homers... good for a 168 OPS+.

RHP Michael Kelly/RHP Austin Adams - Similar to the Angels relievers above. Journeymen who have found some footing in '24 and simply would add depth to an injured bullpen. Kelly is an odd one. Despite years of sitting in the minors and going overseas, he sports a career 3.15 ERA in 39 MLB games. Adams is very sweeper heavy and I'm sure the M's pitching lab could do some thing with him.

Marlins:

Jazz Chisolm Jr. - Jazz is probably the lone position player on the Marlins who is worth adding that they would give up. He's a free agent in 2027 and is due to make more in arbitration in the coming years. Chisolm was a superstar in '22, but hasn't otherwise lived up to his pedigree as a prospect. He's mostly been a mid .750's OPS guy who steal some bags and hit some homers. I get the feeling the Marlins would be asking for a lot with him, but I'm not sure he's worth it. He's also always hurt.

RHP Declan Cronin/RHP Tanner Scott/RHP Bryan Hoeing - Despite having one of the worst pitching staffs in baseball, the Marlins have some relievers who are absolutely shoving. All 3 of these guys have sub 2 ERA's and have pitched at least 20 innings in '24. Scott is probably the most available of the 3 as he's a free agent in '25. Scott has been one of the best relievers in baseball over the last 2 season... he throws 98 from the left side and pitched 78 innings in relief in '23 with an ERA in the low 2's. Cronin and Hoeing are also very talented, they're just cheap and controlled...

Reds:

RHP Buck Farmer/RHP Alexis Diaz - As crazy as it is to say, the Reds do not have one player who is really worth acquiring outside of Elly De La Cruz and Tyler Stephenson who are both young, controlled, and building blocks for the future of this franchise. Their whole offense has fallen off a cliff... As a team in May they have a collective .605 OPS, everyone is slumping, and they're doing this in the easiest ballpark to hit in baseball. Perhaps there's a young position player the M's like that they can steal, but as of right now, everyone is going through it. Buck Farmer is the lone bright spot in a bullpen that has been horrific. Alexis Diaz is listed here purely off pedigree and past performance.

Rockies:

3B Ryan McMahon - If the M's want to tie down 3B moving forward, McMahon could be an option. Despite terrible home/road splits for his career playing at Coors, McMahon has flipped the script with .818/.918 home/road splits. He's controlled somewhat cheaply at $12-$16 million per year until he's 32 in 2027. McMahon has really upped his walk rate in '24, upping his OBP some 60 points compared to his career averages. He's generally good for 20-25 homers a year and if he can keep the K's around 150 a year but up the walks to say 80-90 like he's on pace for, that's a very valuable bat.

LHP Jalen Beeks - Beeks has an ERA in the low 2's and is the most obvious trade candidate to bring back some value to the Rockies as he's a free agent in '25. Beeks was pretty good in Tampa before a blow up year in '23. He throws 95 from a deceptive arm slot. Would def be a quality depth piece.

Big_Maple
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Big_Maple » Tue May 21, 2024 7:25 pm

Great summary, SoB. Thanks.

I agree that from that list, I would like to get Rooker the most. I was excited about Robert cause he's a beast with the bat, but everything you say is true - he strikes out a lot and doesn't walk much, and god knows we have enough of those guys on the team already. And he fights to stay healthy.

I don't want the flotsam and jetsam, so I'm a hard "no" on guys like Pham and Pillar. Pham is a career .260 guy. Decent, but not exciting. Ditto for Pillar. We have an embarrassing history of taking mediocre hitters and turning them craptastic. These guys will come back to earth, soon, and when they do, we don't want them.

And definitely no to Toro.

There are guys who are FA at the end of the year who aren't on this list. Short term rentals include Alonso or Josh Bell or Goldshmidt. None of these intrigue me.

Nolan Arenado's name has been thrown around a lot. He's having an OK season, slashing .270/.325/.371 but only 3 homers. He has a career track record to suggest he'll get better. But he has 3 years left and a full no-trade clause, so I doubt he's going anywhere. But he'd be an upgrade at 3B. :(

I don't put a lot of stock in rumors about teams that are fringe-y competitive wanting to trade superstars that are a year or so from free agency. That said, I have seen two or three different sources that have all listed Vlad Guerrero Jr. as a guy who could be moved. He'd be costly, but it would be cool to see him in a Mariners uniform.

Which brings me back to Rooker. Hell yes! Swing a deal for him and Mason Miller. Drain the farm! Make it so.

Seattle or Bust
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Seattle or Bust » Tue May 21, 2024 8:30 pm

Big_Maple wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 7:25 pm
Great summary, SoB. Thanks.

I agree that from that list, I would like to get Rooker the most. I was excited about Robert cause he's a beast with the bat, but everything you say is true - he strikes out a lot and doesn't walk much, and god knows we have enough of those guys on the team already. And he fights to stay healthy.

I don't want the flotsam and jetsam, so I'm a hard "no" on guys like Pham and Pillar. Pham is a career .260 guy. Decent, but not exciting. Ditto for Pillar. We have an embarrassing history of taking mediocre hitters and turning them craptastic. These guys will come back to earth, soon, and when they do, we don't want them.

And definitely no to Toro.

There are guys who are FA at the end of the year who aren't on this list. Short term rentals include Alonso or Josh Bell or Goldshmidt. None of these intrigue me.

Nolan Arenado's name has been thrown around a lot. He's having an OK season, slashing .270/.325/.371 but only 3 homers. He has a career track record to suggest he'll get better. But he has 3 years left and a full no-trade clause, so I doubt he's going anywhere. But he'd be an upgrade at 3B. :(

I don't put a lot of stock in rumors about teams that are fringe-y competitive wanting to trade superstars that are a year or so from free agency. That said, I have seen two or three different sources that have all listed Vlad Guerrero Jr. as a guy who could be moved. He'd be costly, but it would be cool to see him in a Mariners uniform.

Which brings me back to Rooker. Hell yes! Swing a deal for him and Mason Miller. Drain the farm! Make it so.
I've always liked Arenado but for the cost of around $62 million for the next 3.5 seasons into his age 36 season... not for me anymore.

I don't see them dumping the farm to add Miller. The M's have Munoz, Brash, Santos locked up long term. I don't think they have much intention of bringing in another high leverage arm with lots of control given the cost.

I'd like to see this deadline:

DFA/Option Urias, Bazardo, Snead. Get Santos back.

M's trade Mitch Haniger, Logan Evans and Ben Williamson to the Rockies for Ryan McMahon.

M's trade Jonatan Clase, Michael Morales, and Ryan Bliss to the A's for Brent Rooker.

M's trade Mitch Garver and Emerson Hancock to the Marlins for Tanner Scott.

harmony
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by harmony » Tue May 21, 2024 8:31 pm

Brent Rooker's 2024 strikeout rate of 32.5 percent is significantly higher than the Mariners' MLB-high 27.9 percent but Rooker could nevertheless help if the 29-year-old can maintain his .281/.358/.578/.935 line with a 168 wRC+.

Steamer and ZiPS project Rooker with rest-of-season lines of .225/.313/.439/.752 and .247.331/.435/766, wRC+ of 118 and 135, and WAR of 1.0 in 78 games and 1.8 in 94 games:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/brent ... tion=DH/OF

Rarely are projections that far apart.

Seattle or Bust
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Seattle or Bust » Tue May 21, 2024 8:41 pm

harmony wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:31 pm
Brent Rooker's 2024 strikeout rate of 32.5 percent is significantly higher than the Mariners' MLB-high 27.9 percent but Rooker could nevertheless help if the 29-year-old can maintain his .281/.358/.578/.935 line with a 168 wRC+.

Steamer and ZiPS project Rooker with rest-of-season lines of .225/.313/.439/.752 and .247.331/.435/766, wRC+ of 118 and 135, and WAR of 1.0 in 78 games and 1.8 in 94 games:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/brent ... tion=DH/OF

Rarely are projections that far apart.
Funny considering his slash since the start of 2023 is: .254/.335/.508/.843. His 136 OPS+ over that time is 15th in baseball.

I think it has to do with the fact that he came out of nowhere. Zips doesn't like that, outliers make the statistics look silly.

Big_Maple
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Big_Maple » Tue May 21, 2024 8:47 pm

harmony wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:31 pm
Brent Rooker's 2024 strikeout rate of 32.5 percent is significantly higher than the Mariners' MLB-high 27.9 percent but Rooker could nevertheless help if the 29-year-old can maintain his .281/.358/.578/.935 line with a 168 wRC+.

Steamer and ZiPS project Rooker with rest-of-season lines of .225/.313/.439/.752 and .247.331/.435/766, wRC+ of 118 and 135, and WAR of 1.0 in 78 games and 1.8 in 94 games:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/brent ... tion=DH/OF

Rarely are projections that far apart.
Interesting. Thanks, harmony.

My enthusiasm is based more on gut reaction than anything else. As I looked closer at his stats on baseball-reference I was struck by how little we have to go on, historically speaking. His age 27 season, for example, was a hot mess.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/play ... br01.shtml

So maybe I am plagued by recency bias. Still, he's looked great in the few games I have seen him play.

Big_Maple
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Big_Maple » Tue May 21, 2024 8:50 pm

Seattle or Bust wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:30 pm

I've always liked Arenado but for the cost of around $62 million for the next 3.5 seasons into his age 36 season... not for me anymore.

I don't see them dumping the farm to add Miller. The M's have Munoz, Brash, Santos locked up long term. I don't think they have much intention of bringing in another high leverage arm with lots of control given the cost.

I'd like to see this deadline:

DFA/Option Urias, Bazardo, Snead. Get Santos back.

M's trade Mitch Haniger, Logan Evans and Ben Williamson to the Rockies for Ryan McMahon.

M's trade Jonatan Clase, Michael Morales, and Ryan Bliss to the A's for Brent Rooker.

M's trade Mitch Garver and Emerson Hancock to the Marlins for Tanner Scott.
Those ticked boxes look good to me.

As for Arenado - he'd be a salary dump, for sure. And he's definitely aging. He's not having a great season so far, so if they traded for him now, they might get a better deal, especially if the Cards ate some of his contract. It will never happen - he'd axe a trade to the M's for sure. So all of this is metaphysical navel gazing.

Seattle or Bust
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Seattle or Bust » Tue May 21, 2024 8:52 pm

Big_Maple wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:47 pm
harmony wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:31 pm
Brent Rooker's 2024 strikeout rate of 32.5 percent is significantly higher than the Mariners' MLB-high 27.9 percent but Rooker could nevertheless help if the 29-year-old can maintain his .281/.358/.578/.935 line with a 168 wRC+.

Steamer and ZiPS project Rooker with rest-of-season lines of .225/.313/.439/.752 and .247.331/.435/766, wRC+ of 118 and 135, and WAR of 1.0 in 78 games and 1.8 in 94 games:

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/brent ... tion=DH/OF

Rarely are projections that far apart.
Interesting. Thanks, harmony.

My enthusiasm is based more on gut reaction than anything else. As I looked closer at his stats on baseball-reference I was struck by how little we have to go on, historically speaking. His age 27 season, for example, was a hot mess.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/play ... br01.shtml

So maybe I am plagued by recency bias. Still, he's looked great in the few games I have seen him play.
I mean his age 27 season was also split between 2 teams and he played 16 games. He got a look in 2021 with Minnesota but was shunned for posting a .688 OPS.

He was a top 100 prospect in 2018 in the BA rankings.

In 140 minor league games split between '21/'22 he slashed like 1.150 with 35 homers.

The talent to be this good was there.

Big_Maple
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Big_Maple » Tue May 21, 2024 8:56 pm

Seattle or Bust wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:52 pm

The talent to be this good was there.
I'm sure that Kelenic is standing on the outside looking, right now - and wishing this comment was made about him.

Prospects are always just prospects. Fake it till ya make it.

Hey - have you ever read Calico Joe, by John Grisham? Seems like you would have read it, and if you haven't that you'd enjoy it.

https://www.amazon.com/Calico-Joe-Novel ... 0345541332

Seattle or Bust
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Re: Players to look at adding from clear sellers.

Post by Seattle or Bust » Tue May 21, 2024 8:57 pm

Big_Maple wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:56 pm
Seattle or Bust wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 8:52 pm

The talent to be this good was there.
I'm sure that Kelenic is standing on the outside looking, right now - and wishing this comment was made about him.

Prospects are always just prospects. Fake it till ya make it.

Hey - have you ever read Calico Joe, by John Grisham? Seems like you would have read it, and if you haven't that you'd enjoy it.

https://www.amazon.com/Calico-Joe-Novel ... 0345541332
I mean Kelenic is just 24 years old.

He's got time.

And no, not a big reader. But thx.

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