Flowers released

Gametime
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Gametime » Fri Oct 15, 2021 5:29 pm

So true. We are worse everywhere. We knew it would with Russ going from 1 million (not sure exact amount) to 35 million. But, no idea John would crap the bed in drafting like he has.

SeattleAddict
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Re: Flowers released

Post by SeattleAddict » Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:07 pm

Gametime wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 4:51 pm


Kam and Earl vs Adams and Diggs--not close
Jones and Reed and Ugo vs Sherm and Browner and Maxwell--again not in the same stratosphere
Dunlap and Benson/Hyder/Green vs Bryant and Clemmons/Avril/Bennett--again not in the same stratosphere
DT Poona and Mone vs Mebane and McDaniel--lesser now
LB Wagner Taylor and Brooks vs Wagner and KJ and Irvin--again lesser now

We are worse at every single position area. And worse by huge margins. And we are coached worse. Norton as the leader???

It isn't the scheme as much as it is the players. John has done a shitty job of drafting and player acquisition too.
It's not really fair to compare what was possibly the best defense (at least top 5) in the history of the NFL, though. Of COURSE they're going to be worse.

Instead, look at how they compare vs an average NFL team:
Adams and Diggs - one of the best safety duos in the NFL. Could be argued THE best -- last year, anyway.
Cornerbacks - awful. But talent-wise they should be more middle of the pack.
D-line - again, on paper should be fair-to-middlin' by NFL standards. They have not played that way.
LB - BWagz is still playing at an elite level. Brooks has been really disappointing this year. Taylor, I think, is one dimensional. Basically a situational pass rusher vs a starting LB. But that was Irvin, too.

So, with the exception of CBs, this defense SHOULD be at least average, and probably good, but instead, they are dead last. That is scheme/coaching.

Gametime
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Gametime » Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:14 pm

Drafting and coaching have been bad.

The so called improvement last year was directly attributed the bad Qbs we faced.

Talent and coaching are lacking.

Adams last year sucked in coverage and great at blitzing. I would argue he’s not a great safety.

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Donn Beach
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Donn Beach » Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:44 am

SeattleAddict wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 8:07 pm
Gametime wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 4:51 pm


Kam and Earl vs Adams and Diggs--not close
Jones and Reed and Ugo vs Sherm and Browner and Maxwell--again not in the same stratosphere
Dunlap and Benson/Hyder/Green vs Bryant and Clemmons/Avril/Bennett--again not in the same stratosphere
DT Poona and Mone vs Mebane and McDaniel--lesser now
LB Wagner Taylor and Brooks vs Wagner and KJ and Irvin--again lesser now

We are worse at every single position area. And worse by huge margins. And we are coached worse. Norton as the leader???

It isn't the scheme as much as it is the players. John has done a shitty job of drafting and player acquisition too.
It's not really fair to compare what was possibly the best defense (at least top 5) in the history of the NFL, though. Of COURSE they're going to be worse.

Instead, look at how they compare vs an average NFL team:
Adams and Diggs - one of the best safety duos in the NFL. Could be argued THE best -- last year, anyway.
Cornerbacks - awful. But talent-wise they should be more middle of the pack.
D-line - again, on paper should be fair-to-middlin' by NFL standards. They have not played that way.
LB - BWagz is still playing at an elite level. Brooks has been really disappointing this year. Taylor, I think, is one dimensional. Basically a situational pass rusher vs a starting LB. But that was Irvin, too.

So, with the exception of CBs, this defense SHOULD be at least average, and probably good, but instead, they are dead last. That is scheme/coaching.

yeah, its not about being the best defense, geez they are about to set a record for yards allowed. Just be a stinking average defense! To me they are clearly playing below their talent level. That is what I am seeing.

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Sibelius Hindemith
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Sibelius Hindemith » Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:09 am

The thing that puzzles me is why Carroll is seemingly befuddled and perplexed at how they are playing. Isn't he there at all the practices?

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Donn Beach
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Donn Beach » Sat Oct 16, 2021 11:51 am

and defense is what he is supposed to be good at, in particular defensive backs...that was the deal last season, finally get an explosive offense and the defense falls apart, who would have thunk...and here we go again

Michael K.
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Re: Flowers released

Post by Michael K. » Sat Oct 16, 2021 4:30 pm

Gametime wrote:
Fri Oct 15, 2021 4:51 pm

Is it that they figured it out or when you don't have elite players at every level it doesn't work. I think it is the severe lack of elite or even good players.

Kam and Earl vs Adams and Diggs--not close
Jones and Reed and Ugo vs Sherm and Browner and Maxwell--again not in the same stratosphere
Dunlap and Benson/Hyder/Green vs Bryant and Clemmons/Avril/Bennett--again not in the same stratosphere
DT Poona and Mone vs Mebane and McDaniel--lesser now
LB Wagner Taylor and Brooks vs Wagner and KJ and Irvin--again lesser now

We are worse at every single position area. And worse by huge margins. And we are coached worse. Norton as the leader???

It isn't the scheme as much as it is the players. John has done a shitty job of drafting and player acquisition too.
When you do the same exact thing for ten years, you don't think NFL coaches are going to find ways to beat it?

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douche
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Re: Flowers released

Post by douche » Sat Oct 16, 2021 5:31 pm

Sibelius Hindemith wrote:
Sat Oct 16, 2021 7:09 am
The thing that puzzles me is why Carroll is seemingly befuddled and perplexed at how they are playing. Isn't he there at all the practices?
I also find it puzzling. It's as if Pete simply has the players run around at practice, and he chews gum and slaps butts as if he's just happy to be there.

This clown has been implementing the same game plan for 10 years (and essentially advertises it), and then wonders why it doesn't work. Because the opposition have figured it out! It astounds me to think that a coach would reveal his game plan beforehand. Especially when he doesn't have the personnel to pull it off.

SeattleAddict
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Re: Flowers released

Post by SeattleAddict » Sat Oct 16, 2021 5:54 pm

I think it goes beyond teams "figuring it out"... that plays a part, for sure, but I think that's just one factor.

Add to that:
* they don't disguise coverages. Every coverage has a weakness. If the other team knows what you're playing, there is a play to take advantage.
* it's overly complicated. For some reason, they just don't seem to want to play straight man-to-man. I've never seen so many switches and combinations. So, every time the other team puts a group of 3 WRs on the same side, you have 3 people having to make split second decisions of who to cover instead of just following their guy. If one of those guys makes the wrong mistake, somebody is left wide open.
* the fucking zone blitz where they have a DE cover a WR. Seriously, ditch that garbage, it fools no one and gets beaten every time.
* the D-Line is just not getting pressure very often. They have a bunch of guys that are pretty good, but not great, and they are splitting time almost equally. That keeps them fresh, but maybe they need to leave guys out there for a while when they're playing well (Alton Robinson).

All of these things are amplified when you don't have a lot of talent at the CB position.

My solution:
Play simpler. Either a zone or straight man-to-man, stop switching off. Let the players play with instinct, instead of constantly thinking about which direction they're supposed to go. Their zone is straight garbage, but I'm not sure who is to blame. I kinda think you want to put Ugo and Blair out there, and let Adams play in the box.

Disguise some friggin' defenses. Make the QB question his read a little bit..

Dump LJ Collier. Seahawks 2-1 when he's inactive. 0-2 when he's active.

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D-train
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Re: Flowers released

Post by D-train » Sat Oct 16, 2021 6:30 pm

I was just thinking. Are there any guys on this team that any of you are a big fan of. I was a DK fan until he started acting like a tool and Carson when he can perform but I honestly don't think I can say I am a fan of a single player on this team.
dt

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