Mariner Talk Chat Forum

Michael K. wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 7:50 pm

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 7:45 pm

Sibelius Hindemith wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 7:42 pm

Doesn't that quote seem to confirm our suspicions that the graders don't really take "quality of opposition" into account when evaluating plays?

Why would they? Overly complicates the assessment. In baseball a hit is worth the same whether it is off Verlander or Marco. Everything evens out in the end as everybody faces good and bad players throughout the season.

You are comparing stats to grades. If you are grading how well someone does their job, the surrounding conditions should be factored in.

Nah its too much. Great players have a couple bad plays a game and bad players have a couple great plays every game. If a great player has a bad play or takes a play off you are going to still reward the guy going against him on that play because he is usually good? Like I said it all evens out in the end.

Good points. Ideally they could factor in quality of opponent but it would be impractical if not impossible to do it in a precise way and probably not impact the final season grade all that much. But does the Seahawks' weak SoS mean all their grades are slightly inflated?

Michael K. wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 7:50 pm

You are comparing stats to grades. If you are grading how well someone does their job, the surrounding conditions should be factored in.

yup. Keep saying this about PFF. Left tackles will just by default get graded worse than RTs because they are going against the superstars.

Just checked stats thinking about this and Philly has 4 guys with 11+ sacks?? Holy shit.

Of the top 5 rated LTs only the 4th McGary is a RT

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/t

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 8:56 pm

Of the top 5 rated LTs only the 4th McGary is a RT

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/t

and? The LT is supposed to be the best player on the line, if not the whole offense. Every left tackle should be better than every right tackle, with possible exception of left handed QBs, I suppose. So by sheer default, the top 32 tackles should be LTs. Obviously, that is never going to be exactly the case, but my point was simply that if you don't factor in quality of opposition, LTs get graded tougher than RTs.

The simple solution would be for PFF to not lump all Ts together, and list them in order of LT and RT.

SeattleAddict wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:13 pm

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 8:56 pm

Of the top 5 rated LTs only the 4th McGary is a RT

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/t

and? The LT is supposed to be the best player on the line, if not the whole offense. Every left tackle should be better than every right tackle, with possible exception of left handed QBs, I suppose. So by sheer default, the top 32 tackles should be LTs. Obviously, that is never going to be exactly the case, but my point was simply that if you don't factor in quality of opposition, LTs get graded tougher than RTs.

The simple solution would be for PFF to not lump all Ts together, and list them in order of LT and RT.

And? Why would you want to compare a RT to a LT anyway? It would be like comparing a SS or Catcher to a 1B or LF. Doesn't make sense.

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:21 pm

SeattleAddict wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:13 pm

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 8:56 pm

Of the top 5 rated LTs only the 4th McGary is a RT

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/t

and? The LT is supposed to be the best player on the line, if not the whole offense. Every left tackle should be better than every right tackle, with possible exception of left handed QBs, I suppose. So by sheer default, the top 32 tackles should be LTs. Obviously, that is never going to be exactly the case, but my point was simply that if you don't factor in quality of opposition, LTs get graded tougher than RTs.

The simple solution would be for PFF to not lump all Ts together, and list them in order of LT and RT.

And? Why would you want to compare a RT to a LT anyway? It would be like comparing a SS or Catcher to a 1B or LF. Doesn't make sense.

That's the point. PFF lists all tackles in one lump, yet they go against different quality of opponents. Going against Nick Bosa 45 plays is different than 45 plays against LJ Collier, yet they're weighted the same in their formula.

SeattleAddict wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:26 pm

D-train wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:21 pm

SeattleAddict wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 14, 2023 9:13 pm

and? The LT is supposed to be the best player on the line, if not the whole offense. Every left tackle should be better than every right tackle, with possible exception of left handed QBs, I suppose. So by sheer default, the top 32 tackles should be LTs. Obviously, that is never going to be exactly the case, but my point was simply that if you don't factor in quality of opposition, LTs get graded tougher than RTs.

The simple solution would be for PFF to not lump all Ts together, and list them in order of LT and RT.

And? Why would you want to compare a RT to a LT anyway? It would be like comparing a SS or Catcher to a 1B or LF. Doesn't make sense.

That's the point. PFF lists all tackles in one lump, yet they go against different quality of opponents. Going against Nick Bosa 45 plays is different than 45 plays against LJ Collier, yet they're weighted the same in their formula.

Ok yeah they should break them out as LT vs. RT. Totally agree with that.

Although I like the kid,
Tariq Wollen is the most overrated of our rookies.
Gregg Bell tweeted Shanahan schemed at Wollen all day.

Well rookie of the year is pretty highly rated I guess