Mariner Talk Chat Forum

Posted: **Tue Mar 22, 2022 3:16 am**

NFL rumors says he prefers Panthers over us.

Posted: **Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:54 pm**

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:04 am**

God I hope so, lol. I keep seeing people say he just makes too much sense for us though, which I completely disagree with. He, much like Wilson, is not a QB that can lead you to the SB - he needs a huge supporting cast to get it done. If he could be had for a 7th round pick then he's worth a flyer for a little while but anything higher than that then forget it.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 4:10 pm**

Lamda wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:04 am
God I hope so, lol. I keep seeing people say he just makes too much sense for us though, which I completely disagree with. He, much like Wilson, is not a QB that can lead you to the SB - he needs a huge supporting cast to get it done. If he could be had for a 7th round pick then he's worth a flyer for a little while but anything higher than that then forget it.

this is such a weird take that I keep seeing. Where are all these QBs that can lead you to a SB without a great supporting cast?

2021 Rams, stacked their team with free agent stars, including a QB with no playoff wins so CLEARLY he couldn't do it.
2020 Bucs, stacked their team with free agent stars.
2019 Chiefs, stacked roster
2018 Pats, stacked roster
2017 Eagles, with a backup QB
2016 Pats, stacked roster
2015 Broncos stacked roster
2014 Pats stacked roster
2013 Seahawks stacked roster
2012 Ravens stacked roster

So, your only options that meet your criteria in the whole NFL are
Stafford (never won a playoff game before, so clearly can't do it without a huge supporting cast)
Brady (GOAT, but also had great supporting casts)
Mahomes (on rookie contract with a great supporting cast)
Nick Foles (backup quality)
Manning (retired, great supporting cast)
Wilson
Flacco (retired, backup quality)

So really, your only option is MAYBE Mahomes... great, let's sign him. Maybe for like a 6th rounder?

In the NFL, you basically have two paths to success: Find a stud QB on a rookie deal and build a great team around him, or build a great team and get a QB that's good enough to manage it. I'm not real excited about Mayfield, and he isn't the former, but he could be the latter. Lock is on a rookie deal, but is clearly not a stud QB. Maybe he's the "good enough" type, but even that hasn't been proven yet, and this team needs an upgrade.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:26 pm**

SeattleAddict wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 05, 2022 4:10 pm

Lamda wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:04 am
God I hope so, lol. I keep seeing people say he just makes too much sense for us though, which I completely disagree with. He, much like Wilson, is not a QB that can lead you to the SB - he needs a huge supporting cast to get it done. If he could be had for a 7th round pick then he's worth a flyer for a little while but anything higher than that then forget it.
this is such a weird take that I keep seeing. Where are all these QBs that can lead you to a SB without a great supporting cast?

2021 Rams, stacked their team with free agent stars, including a QB with no playoff wins so CLEARLY he couldn't do it.
2020 Bucs, stacked their team with free agent stars.
2019 Chiefs, stacked roster
2018 Pats, stacked roster
2017 Eagles, with a backup QB
2016 Pats, stacked roster
2015 Broncos stacked roster
2014 Pats stacked roster
2013 Seahawks stacked roster
2012 Ravens stacked roster

So, your only options that meet your criteria in the whole NFL are
Stafford (never won a playoff game before, so clearly can't do it without a huge supporting cast)
Brady (GOAT, but also had great supporting casts)
Mahomes (on rookie contract with a great supporting cast)
Nick Foles (backup quality)
Manning (retired, great supporting cast)
Wilson
Flacco (retired, backup quality)

So really, your only option is MAYBE Mahomes... great, let's sign him. Maybe for like a 6th rounder?

In the NFL, you basically have two paths to success: Find a stud QB on a rookie deal and build a great team around him, or build a great team and get a QB that's good enough to manage it. I'm not real excited about Mayfield, and he isn't the former, but he could be the latter. Lock is on a rookie deal, but is clearly not a stud QB. Maybe he's the "good enough" type, but even that hasn't been proven yet, and this team needs an upgrade.

Great post! Amazing how facts get in the way of perceptions.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:57 pm**

As I have said, the only thing we KNOW is....once a QB eats up a ton of cap? They normally don't win a Super Bowl. Still, it is hard to ignore that other than Foles and Flacco? Find me a winning QB that isn't a stud. Don't say Stafford. Flip flop him and Brady and we might be talking about a different GOAT.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:50 pm**

Michael K. wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:57 pm
As I have said, the only thing we KNOW is....once a QB eats up a ton of cap? They normally don't win a Super Bowl. Still, it is hard to ignore that other than Foles and Flacco? Find me a winning QB that isn't a stud. Don't say Stafford. Flip flop him and Brady and we might be talking about a different GOAT.

I mean, 4 of the last 10 super bowl winners have been led by Brady, so it's hard to find exceptions if you eliminate him. The Rams won with not only Stafford's salary, but Goff's too, right? (I'm not sure but I thought there was a ton of dead money... could be wrong)

So, let's eliminate those 5, and consider the other 5: Mahomes rookie deal, Wilson rookie deal, Flacco and Foles 2nd tier QBs, and Manning.

It seems to me, there are a fair amount of exceptions, and essentially 3 ways to win: Have a stud QB on a rookie deal, have a decent QB but a great roster, or have a Brady (or Manning I suppose).

I think your point is you can't overpay the QB, and I fully agree with that. On the flip side, if you DON'T pay your QB, then you have almost no chance, either. I really honestly thought RW would take a team friendly deal so we could make a run at it. I really did. I blame Ciara. I'm not saying she isn't a good person, but RW went down the diva trail when he married her, and money became more important than winning.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:04 pm**

Rookie deals are part of what I said, right? You need the QB and he can’t eat up all the cap. So, rookies or guys like Brady taking less.

Again, not many mediocre or average QBs winning rings. Wilson and Mahomes look like HOF guys. They may never win another ring, because neither is willing to take less. So, the key? A guy like Brady or a stud rookie.

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 11:03 pm**

yeah your point is valid. I'm just saying that's not the ONLY way. That's the BEST way (most likely to succeed anyway), but it can be done in other ways. The fact that Brady is in the mix skews all results. If Mahomes and Brady didn't exist, other Super Bowl winners might have been Jimmy G (very average), Jared Goff (very average), and Matt Ryan (big contract).

The problem with Lock (well, one of them), is that if he ends up great, he's going to get a huge contract in a year or two. I don't think the Seahawks are really looking for QBs in this draft, at least not round 1 or 2. I think their plan is to get one next year... if needed.

Posted: **Wed Apr 06, 2022 4:51 am**

Good point...and we might have been a 49er dropped INT away from Jimmy G winning this year!

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