Gardner Minshew

[Michael K.]

Arguably happened just a month or two ago. Stafford is pretty good, but I don't think of him among the top 5, and maybe not in the top 10. He's better than mediocre, though, so I'm not willing to die on that mountain.

For a better example it's been a minute because Brady and Mahomes have dominated recent years, and there are probably 20 QBs that qualify as better-than-average so you're not going to get a lot of champions out of the remaining bottom dwellers. Foles and Flacco did it and Garrapolo made it there. Heck, Foles was the backup to Wentz, who is the epitome of 'average'

The better question is how the hell the Seahawks defense could possibly get to an 'elite' status. Outside of our safeties, we don't have anybody close to Pro Bowl level, lost our HOF signal caller, and a DC with no experience and led a group that produced one of the worst pass rushes in modern history. They would need to replicate a Thomas/Wagner/Kam/Sherm/Avril/Bennett off season, and that is not likely.

That is kind of my point, and I might not have made it very well. One first round pick on defense isn't going to make us elite, but a QB on a rookie deal that is a dual threat and has weapons around him? By next year we had two drafts and two off seasons with cap space, this talented yet raw rookie has, probably, Lockett, DK and Fant, and who know who else we can add as weapons or O Lineman, plus defenders.

We have seen it before, bring in young and hungry, those guys respond to this coach. I am not saying it is guaranteed to happen again, but I just don't see this team competitive for a long time relying on a Drew Lock or a Gardner Minshew. But, dual threat QB? The read option becomes a threat again, AND we have money and picks to surround him with players?

The chances of the #9 pick being a defender and quickly turning around this 7 win team seems lower, to me, than if it is a QB. That said, who's to say we don't find a QB with another of those picks or some of this cap space?

[SeattleAddict]

I hear ya. I like Willis as a project, but not at #9. It's just such a huge gamble - like 80% of projected first round QBs end up shit, and he isn't really even graded as a first round talent... but because he's a QB in a QB-lacking draft, we're talking about him in the top 10? Makes me cringe. Now, if they trade down and pick him at #20 or so? I'm in. Otherwise, a stud pass rusher would make a huge difference, and maybe try to get our guy with our inevitable top-10 pick next year.

[Michael K.]

I hear ya. I like Willis as a project, but not at #9. It's just such a huge gamble - like 80% of projected first round QBs end up shit, and he isn't really even graded as a first round talent... but because he's a QB in a QB-lacking draft, we're talking about him in the top 10? Makes me cringe. Now, if they trade down and pick him at #20 or so? I'm in. Otherwise, a stud pass rusher would make a huge difference, and maybe try to get our guy with our inevitable top-10 pick next year.

Man, maybe I am just misremembering, but I don't remember that many Qbs going in the first that didn't pan out. Trubisky? But the Bears are just stupid. Many scoffed at the Bills on Allen, I remember reading that Watson was too frail, Mahomes to erratic, Mac Jones wasn't ready...heck, the worst of the bunch lately has been Trevor Lawrence, and I am pretty sure that wasn't his fault.

[SeattleAddict]

I hear ya. I like Willis as a project, but not at #9. It's just such a huge gamble - like 80% of projected first round QBs end up shit, and he isn't really even graded as a first round talent... but because he's a QB in a QB-lacking draft, we're talking about him in the top 10? Makes me cringe. Now, if they trade down and pick him at #20 or so? I'm in. Otherwise, a stud pass rusher would make a huge difference, and maybe try to get our guy with our inevitable top-10 pick next year.

Man, maybe I am just misremembering, but I don't remember that many Qbs going in the first that didn't pan out. Trubisky? But the Bears are just stupid. Many scoffed at the Bills on Allen, I remember reading that Watson was too frail, Mahomes to erratic, Mac Jones wasn't ready...heck, the worst of the bunch lately has been Trevor Lawrence, and I am pretty sure that wasn't his fault.

You're probably right, my 80% remark was hyperbole. Most of the franchise QBs were #1 picks, but I also remember first round QBs in the past 8 drafts:

Tua, Love, Daniel Jones, Haskins, Mayfield (?), Darnold, Rosen, Goff, Wentz, Paxton Lynch, Winston, Mariota, Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, and EJ Manuel

to counteract Mahomes, Watson, Allen, Murray, Burrow and Herbert

So 6/22 turned out elite, with a bunch of shit from the rest (a few had some decent years). Point is, it's risky, unless you're really sure about a guy.

[Gametime]

Drafting QBs is just so dang hard. I wouldn't have an issue with Malik with the 9. Sure be fun. I was also super excited when we drafted Mirer. He did look good his first year behind that horrid line. Which i think really ended his career mentally. But, I think Malik has that "it" factor. Really with the new wave QB stuff. He is not tall, but elusive and a big arm. I like that. After him giving clothes to the homeless person not knowing it was being recorded was beyond awesome and would like him here. But, If I am a betting man I can see them trading down and getting Corrall from Ole Miss. I am not sold on Matt at all. But, if he was in the second round heck yes. Not in the first. Only QB I am taking in the first (9-20 in the first) is Malik. There is a lot to like about Malik in my opinion. I just don't think John or Pete will draft a QB at 9.

Oh Well, it will be crazy.

[ddraig]

He got that swag. But he is not a franchise QB just a dude with some pizzaz

That's what they said about Joe Namath.

Seriously though, I'd be on board with Minshew. Nobody is saying he's a franchise QB, but he IS a gamer, and would generate some interest in a team that REALLY needs some.

Yes, far better than Lock in that dept.

And far better than CK.

[Lamda]

You're probably right, my 80% remark was hyperbole. Most of the franchise QBs were #1 picks, but I also remember first round QBs in the past 8 drafts:

Tua, Love, Daniel Jones, Haskins, Mayfield (?), Darnold, Rosen, Goff, Wentz, Paxton Lynch, Winston, Mariota, Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, and EJ Manuel

to counteract Mahomes, Watson, Allen, Murray, Burrow and Herbert

So 6/22 turned out elite, with a bunch of shit from the rest (a few had some decent years). Point is, it's risky, unless you're really sure about a guy.

You are right - most qb's in the first round flop. It would be interesting to research how many players in the first round actually become legit players/stars.

[Michael K.]

You're probably right, my 80% remark was hyperbole. Most of the franchise QBs were #1 picks, but I also remember first round QBs in the past 8 drafts:

Tua, Love, Daniel Jones, Haskins, Mayfield (?), Darnold, Rosen, Goff, Wentz, Paxton Lynch, Winston, Mariota, Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, and EJ Manuel

to counteract Mahomes, Watson, Allen, Murray, Burrow and Herbert

So 6/22 turned out elite, with a bunch of shit from the rest (a few had some decent years). Point is, it's risky, unless you're really sure about a guy.

To be fair, it is a bit early to give up on Tua. Mayfield lead his team to an eyelash of beating the Chiefs in the playoffs last year, Goff won an NFC Championship, Wentz was on pace to win an MVP before getting hurt and his team won the ring that year, Winston is a talent, just a dumbass, Bridgewater looked the part before the first injury. That changes that list considerably.

Wilson could have easily been Carson Wentz. What if Wentz had been our guy and Russ had been Phillies? Do you think their career's would have been the same? The read option, BeastMode and a great defense won a Super Bowl. Not Russ, but one of his INTs sure lost it.

[SeattleAddict]

You are right - most qb's in the first round flop. It would be interesting to research how many players in the first round actually become legit players/stars.

I thought it'd be way too hard to determine, since there are so many ways to weigh 'success' - like Ifedi was a starter for a long time, but we all know he sucked. So, I looked it up, and a couple people did the research for us:

https://football.pitcherlist.com/pessim ... nfl-draft/

basically, don't draft WR or TE in first round, and QB is a crap shoot.

https://theriotreport.com/more-than-50- ... tatistics/

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/742 ... or-success

this has some info on later round picks, too. https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nfl/new ... cz1aaqydrj

[Michael K.]

Really wanted to read that first article, and will try later. But I could NOT get rid of the pop up add that kept appearing right on top of the text! Does anyone think that people will buy something they saw on an add that pissed them off?

Reminds me of one from the other day. I get this add that you can't clear, have to watch the full 20 second video for some game that I would never play. One of their selling points was "no annoying ads". So, you place an annoying add for your product on something I actually want to see, and tell me you understand that I am annoyed by ads?