Hamas Attack in Israel

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bpj
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Sun Nov 19, 2023 12:53 pm

Is this true?
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https://twitter.com/SamParkerSenate/sta ... Wogdw&s=19

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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Mon Nov 20, 2023 10:54 am

They're not even trying to hide it now, it's all about taking over the land to them.

They want water parks and oil rigs and new canals to run through Gaza.
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That's what this was about. All they needed was a reason, so they provoked them:

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bpj
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Mon Nov 20, 2023 1:26 pm

Another good example of how this didn't start October 7th.
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Tue Nov 21, 2023 8:06 am

Doesn't look like people are buying what Israel's selling.

Getting ratioed by one of the people reporting in Gaza.
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by ddraig » Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:17 pm

Al-Shifa Hospital and the pathological distrust of Israel
From CNN to the radical left, why won’t people accept the truth about Hamas’s horrors at al-Shifa?

Brendan O'Neill
BRENDAN O'NEILL
CHIEF POLITICAL WRITER
20th November 2023

We need to talk about the pathological distrust of Israel. About the speed and relish with which our media elites dismiss every Israeli claim about the war in Gaza. Consider the Battle of al-Shifa Hospital. Israeli officials have offered up ample proof that the hospital was used as a military base by Hamas. They’ve shown us caches of weapons, video footage of gun-toting, knife-wielding men hurrying hostages through corridors, a vast tunnel that is 10 metres down and 55 metres long. And yet it is all breezily discounted. This is not healthy scepticism of ‘war propaganda’ – it’s a dogmatic refusal to accept a single thing the Jewish State says.

The morbid disbelief of Israeli evidence has reached insane levels in recent days. When IDF commanders displayed the Kalashnikovs, ammunition, hand grenades and bullet-proof vests they found at al-Shifa, the woke media shrugged. These are just ‘small stashes’ of weapons, said the BBC in its best haughty voice. This begs the question of how much weaponry Britain’s public broadcaster thinks it is acceptable for a fascist movement to store in a hospital. Ten guns? Twenty? ‘Those piles of Kalashnikovs’ are ‘frankly not convincing’, said the BBC’s Jeremy Bowen with superb derision. Maybe they belong to the hospital’s ‘security department’, he said.

Left observers have been alarmingly cavalier about the weapons. ‘A few bits of weaponry’ is how one of the people at Novara Media put it. CNN published a ridiculous ‘exposé’ of how the IDF’s display of Hamas weapons seemed to be ‘rearranged’. In some media clips there were more weapons than in other media clips. Yes, because more ‘terrorist assets’ were discovered ‘throughout the day’, said the IDF. Too late for rational explanations, guys: CNN’s ‘exposé’ had already spread like a pox through social media where Islamists and racists giddily cited it as proof that those sneaky Israelis planted the weapons to try to frame poor Hamas.

Yesterday, following Israel’s release of CCTV footage showing armed men hauling bloodied hostages into al-Shifa, things got really ridiculous. All I see are ‘injured hostages’ being taken for ‘medical treatment’, said Guardian columnist Owen Jones. That does not justify ‘Israel’s massacre of the hospital’, he said. Yes, the famously humanitarian Hamas, always keen to care for the civilians it violates and brutalises. One of the Hamas terrorists in the CCTV clip seems to be wielding a meat cleaver. The others have Kalashnikovs – or a ‘few bits of weaponry’, as I think we’re meant to say. These videos are damning in the extreme. That heavily armed terrorists are able to move with impunity through the hospital’s corridors is strong proof that they enjoy some form of dominion there. Anyone who says otherwise is clearly so blinded by Israelophobia that they can no longer see what’s in front of their faces.

And now there’s the tunnel. Israel has released footage of a vast tunnel found under a canopy on the hospital grounds. Also under the canopy was a pick-up truck packed with weapons, similar to the ones Hamas used in its pogrom of 7 October. The CNN hacks who visited the tunnel last night said, no doubt through gritted teeth, that it looks like ‘compelling’ evidence of Hamas malfeasance. ‘But’ – you knew there was a but – ‘even then it was unclear what [the tunnel] was or how far it went down’. Alex Thomson of Channel 4 News said Israel is ‘gradually building evidence of Hamas military activity [at al-Shifa]’, and you could almost sense the disappointment in his voice. But it does not ‘amount to evidence of a Hamas command and control centre’ in the hospital.

They will never be satisfied, will they? They’re shown stashes of lethal weapons, grenades, military clothing. They’re shown videos of Hamas pushing hostages around the hospital. They’re shown a Hamas-style truck with guns in it. They’re shown a tunnel that leads to a blast door with a ‘gunhole for Hamas to shoot through’. And again and again they say: ‘We’re not convinced.’ The bodies of two Israeli hostages were found close to al-Shifa. I swear we’re two or three thinkpieces away from some journalist wondering out loud if the only reason those departed souls were near the hospital is because lovely Hamas took them there for ‘medical treatment’ but it turned out to be too late.

It gets worse. They’re not only dismissing the discoveries of the past few days but also a truth that’s been known for years: that Hamas, unquestionably, has turned al-Shifa into a hellhole base for its sinister operations. The memory-holing of the historical facts we know about al-Shifa has been extraordinary. You won’t believe Israel? Fine, maybe you’ll believe Amnesty International. It published a long, detailed report about Hamas’s torture of Palestinians during the Israel-Gaza conflict of 2014. That conflict resuscitated Hamas-Fatah civil tensions in Gaza, leading to the commission of ‘serious human-rights abuses’ – including abduction, torture and summary execution – by Hamas terrorists against Palestinians suspected of siding with Fatah.

Where did these crimes take place? Al-Shifa. Hamas used the hospital, ‘including the outpatients’ clinic area’, to ‘detain, interrogate, torture and otherwise ill-treat suspects, even as other parts of the hospital continued to function as a medical centre’, said Amnesty. Got that? The exact thing Israel accuses Hamas of doing was already discovered by Amnesty years ago. A former Fatah official who was ‘seriously assaulted’ in his home by Hamas’s henchmen told Amnesty he refused to go to al-Shifa for treatment because ‘any member of Fatah or the [Palestinian Authority] going there would end up with worse injuries’. We know our woke elites won’t listen to Israelis, but maybe they’ll listen to Palestinians, many of whom have known for years that al-Shifa isn’t safe.

Or maybe they’ll believe PBS, the esteemed broadcaster in the US. In 2009, PBS spoke with a senior doctor at al-Shifa who said Hamas terrorists are ‘hiding either in the basement or in a separate underground area underneath the hospital’, and they are ‘aware that they are putting civilians in harm’s way’. Or perhaps they’ll believe the huge numbers of al-Shifa’s doctors who went on strike for a month in 2007 to protest against Hamas’s grotesque persecution of Fatah-aligned medics. The striking doctors were calling on Hamas to ‘leave politics out of the health system’ and to ‘stop using its armed forces against medical personnel’. Does that sound like a movement that respects the sanctity of medical spaces?

The proof of Hamas’s criminal misuse of al-Shifa as a base for torture, murder and warmongering is abundant. Palestinian dissidents have pointed to it. Amnesty has documented the Room 101-style horrors committed by Hamas’s ‘Internal Security officers’ there. Israel has shown us weapons, trucks, tunnels, hostages. Anyone still saying ‘Hmm’ following almost two decades’ worth of proof that Hamas exploits al-Shifa has clearly left the realm of reason and entered the hell of dogma. This is not scepticism, it’s denialism. It is not a noble hunt for ‘the truth’ of war – it’s the sickness of post-truth thinking, where nothing as trifling as evidence can ever be allowed to interfere with one’s ideological bias. Which in this case is that Israel is evil and always lies.

It isn’t hard to work out why so many in the woke elites, from CNN to the influencer left, are clinging for dear life to the lie that al-Shifa was a normal hospital. It’s because they have staked so much on this battle in the Israel-Hamas war. Israel’s conquering of al-Shifa is, in their eyes, the ‘war crime’ that proves beyond doubt that Israel is uniquely malevolent among the nations of Earth, and that they, in contrast, are righteous for opposing it. Every piece of evidence that points to the true war crime being Hamas’s, this fascistic movement that is even willing to hide lethal weaponry among the sick and the newborn and elderly, is a blow not just to their infantile narrative about Israel-Palestine, but also to their own moral prestige, their own cultural authority to determine what is ‘right’ and ‘wrong’. They experience Israel’s assault on Hamas’s base at al-Shifa as an assault on their own reputations – and they are right to.

Scepticism? Please. In instantly disbelieving everything Israel says, these people implicitly buy everything Hamas says. Their Israelophobia translates into a tangible, objective acceptance of Hamas’s own lies about Hamas’s own horrors. The woke love to call themselves anti-fascists, but it’s a strange anti-fascist that gives moral succour to fascists.

Brendan O’Neill is spiked’s chief political writer and host of the spiked podcast, The Brendan O’Neill Show. Subscribe to the podcast here. His new book – A Heretic’s Manifesto: Essays on the Unsayable – is available to order on Amazon UK and Amazon US now. And find Brendan on Instagram: @burntoakboy

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bpj
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Tue Nov 21, 2023 6:54 pm

They say the hospital was a Hamas base, then produce like 1 bag worth of military equipment with about 10 guns that were more likely from injured fighters in the hospital. Certainly not enough weapons to show there was a Hamas base there that supplies the 20,000 Hamas fighters.

Either way, Hamas is in their own territory. Israel is the intruder.

They say Hamas killed their 1,400 people, but Israel's own media confirms Israel killed their own people during the attack while firing indiscriminately into the crowd.

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https://www.businessinsider.com/idf-mis ... hamas?op=1

Nobody believes Israel because they're not credible. Israel is the bully and brought this on themselves.

People believe what Palestinians are claiming because there is truckloads of video and photographic evidence documenting what Israel has done.

All they have against Hamas is what Israel says. Unfortunately nobody believes them because the evidence doesn't match their narrative and they won't supply any actual evidence. We're just supposed to trust them. And we don't.

But Israel wouldn't just kill their own people, right?
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by ddraig » Wed Nov 22, 2023 5:09 pm

Sometimes it is hard to look reality in the face and understand that what you think was right has been wrong all the time. This is an interesting article that tries to set the record straight. I encourage you to look up the facts that are readily available in numerous history books. Some individuals will not do so because this information directly goes against what they think is correct. Such is the state of our education system.

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/20 ... hback.html

November 21, 2023
Susan Sarandon’s noxious antisemitism and, finally, a little pushback
By Andrea Widburg

Susan Sarandon has long been one of Hollywood’s most outspoken leftists. For decades, there hasn’t been a leftist cause that the actress hasn’t loudly embraced. That’s why it’s no surprise that she’s come out strongly in favor of antisemitic attacks on Jews, for that is a hardcore leftist principle, starting with Marx, Lenin, Hitler, and Stalin. Hollywood, however, which has a lot of Jewish people who are getting nervous, has pushed back. Thankfully, at least one Muslim woman has gloriously talked about the freedom Muslims experience in America.

Lately, because of massive amounts of misinformation, I always feel I need to begin my essays about what’s happening in Israel and America with a few facts:

• According to the Bible, for around 3,800 years, Jews have lived continuously in the land on which the modern-day state of Israel sits. According to archaeology, there’s been a Jewish presence on that land since at least 1,200 BC.
• Despite the centuries of Muslim conquest, actual Arabs didn’t figure largely in the land’s history. They eventually drifted into the swampy, disease-infested backwater when it was under Ottoman control, beginning in the 1830s. When Zionist Jews arrived, they purchased the land from its owners.
• Beginning in the 1920s, when British bureaucrats began to sow the seeds of discord between Arabs (who had been grateful for Jewish agriculture, medicine, and education) and the Jews, surrounding Muslim nations began expelling Jewish communities that had existed for as long as 3,000 years. Eventually, almost 900,000 Jews were displaced, all of whom were welcomed in Israel. There are no Jews remaining in most Muslim countries.
• The residents of the areas currently identified as Gaza and the West Bank call themselves “Palestinians,” which is a misnomer. Up until 1967, “Palestinians” referred to the Jewish residents of the region. The change was a political response to the stunning Arab loss in the 1967 War. As Walid Shoebat said, “On June 4, 1967, I was a Jordanian, and overnight I became a Palestinian.”
• The population of self-identified “Palestinians” has swelled from 1.2 million in 1967 to its present 14 million today.
• Israel withdrew completely from Gaza in 2005. There is no “occupation” there.
• Those who keep track claim that Hamas has broken more than 20 ceasefires with Israel. Israel has never broken a ceasefire.
• On October 7, Hamas targeted Israeli civilians, killing over 1,400, many of whom they first raped and tortured.
• Since October 7, Israel has waged war against Hamas, which has hidden its men and arms in, around, and under hospitals, mosques, schools, and apartment buildings. Israel has consistently delayed military operations to allow civilians to evacuate military targets.
• Jews make up approximately 2.4% of the American population. Muslims make up approximately 1% of the American population. They are expected to exceed Jews in number around 2025.
• In 2022, when it came to religious-based hate crimes, there were 1,124 anti-Jewish incidents. Arabs, Muslims, and Sikhs combined, faced 431 hate crimes.

With that very incomplete context, let’s look at what Susan Sarandon has been saying:

She joined the crowd in chanting “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” – which is largely regarded as an antisemitic slogan that implies the decimation of Israel – before addressing the group herself.

“There are a lot of people that are afraid, that are afraid of being Jewish at this time, and are getting a taste of what it feels like to be a Muslim in this country,” she said.

Many in the crowd she addressed handed out flyers with the names and addresses of Jewish people and organizations as targets for retaliation.

Sarandon is an antisemitic ignoramus and a vile, disgusting excuse for a human being. She’s also no longer a box office draw. More than that, all the reliably leftist Jews in Hollywood are becoming scared. Being a Jewish leftist who spouts “Critical Race Theory,” “Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion,” “Transgender Theory,” anti-Americanism, and the other fashionable academic tropes is all fun and games until the Gestapo and Brown Shirts come calling…and that’s what America’s leftist Jews are beginning to realize is a real possibility.

So, Sarandon finally faced a consequence for her long-standing socialist-driven antisemitism:

Oscar winner Susan Sarandon has been dropped by top Hollywood agency UTA after saying frightened Jews are “getting a taste of how it feels to be Muslim in America,” Page Six can reveal.

I agree with UTA. Anti-Jewish thinking (a European, Christian concept) and antisemitism (a Marxist concept) both have an ugly history of inciting genocidal fury. Sarandon won’t change her very little mind, but her career comeuppance might cause others to reexamine their beliefs.

Much more importantly, the murderous hostility she voices might drive Jews to stop sending money to antisemitic institutions (e.g., every college but Hillsdale and the entire mainstream media) and to help fund organizations and media outlets that are not steeped in racial and antisemitic hatred.

As an antidote to Sarandon’s venom and ignorance, I urge you to read this tweet in its entirety:

Post to X by Asra Nomani
Hi there @SusanSarandon, this is my mom, my dad and me on the rail trail in Morgantown, West by God Virginia. Let me tell you what it means to be Muslim in America. First, your backstory: At an anti-Israel protest in NYC, you just said, "There are a lot of people that are afraid, that are afraid of being Jewish at this time, and are getting a taste of what it feels like to be a Muslim in this country.”

Let me give you “a taste” of what it “feels like” to be a Muslim in America: My dad didn’t have to become a second-class indentured servant to one of the many tyrants of Muslim countries that use immigrants from India, like my family, as essential slaves. In 1975, after getting his PhD at Rutgers, he was about to go to Libya — a Muslim country — led by a Muslim, Moammar Qhadafi, to work like a servant with a PhD for a wealthy dictator…but then the phone rang one day and I picked it up… It was West Virginia University calling, and my dad got a job as an assistant professor of nutrition. He got rejected first for tenure but being Muslim in America meant he got a right like everybody got — his right to appeal and guess what? He won and he became a full professor. That’s what it means to be Muslim in America. You get your full rights, like @DrZuhdiJasser has wished for his family in the Muslim nation of Syria, where a Muslim dictator destroys the lives of Muslims.

My mom? Being Muslim in America meant she got to live FREE with the wind in her hair, like
@AlinejadMasih fights for women in the Muslim nation of Iran to be able to enjoy.

And what did living free mean for my mom as a Muslim in America? It meant in 1981 she got to start a business on High Street in downtown Morgantown, called Ain’s International. That is something that @miss9afi wished women could have had the right to do in the Muslim nation of Saudi Arabia. But guess what? That entrepreneurship and financial independence is denied Muslim women in so many Muslim countries.

That summer my mom started her business, I got on a plane at Pittsburgh airport for Tahlequah, Oklahama, and I went away from home at 16 for a National Science Foundation camp — without a male chaperone, a right denied Muslim women and girls in Saudi for so long.

In another “taste” of being Muslim in America? My family got a pathway to citizenship. You think the Muslim dictatorship of Qatar allows a pathway to citizenship for Muslim slaves, servants or Palestinian Muslims? Hell no. The Muslim Al-Thani family just buys citizenship for Muslim soccer stars from countries in Africa to steal World Cup wins. But otherwise it treats non-Qatari Muslims like slaves. America? My family waited, took the test, studied the constitution and we are citizens — hallelujah!

I’m going to fast forward because this is just a “taste” of what it means to be Muslim in America. In 2002, I fled Pakistan with a souvenir that could have gotten me imprisoned or killed: a baby growing inside of me, a wedding ring not upon my hand. Sharia law makes sex out of marriage a crime in Muslim countries like Pakistan. My body? The mullah’s tyranny. And even dare to be atheist like
@YasMohammedxx? It’s also a crime punishable by death — in Muslim countries but not in America! Where do you think I came to give birth to my baby in safety and security, without shame? West by God Virginia in the United States of America — where we enjoy equal rights as Muslim AmeriCANs, not AmeriCANTs. This is a “taste” of life for a Muslim family in America.

Please don’t minimize the experience of Jewish Americans by sanitizing the hell that it is for Muslims living in Muslim countries and vilifying America for the life — and freedoms — she offers Muslims like my family. Go, live like a Muslim woman in a Muslim country. You will come back to America and kiss the land beneath your feet.

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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by gil » Wed Nov 22, 2023 6:58 pm

ddraig,
The American Thinker is often too "right wing" for me, but I think this is a good article.

Antisemitism is real. I'm glad people are fighting it.

The post by Asra Nomani is great! For people who love and champion freedom, this is a good reminder that many Muslim countries around the world (including those surrounding Israel) do not allow the freedoms that are discussed in this post, that the author and her family found in America. I admit that I am open to being proven wrong, but I will posit that Muslims (Arabs/Palestinians) in Israel enjoy more freedoms than they do in Syria or Egypt (or Gaza).

No I'm not saying that Israel is perfect. I don't like the encouragement of West Bank settlements. I don't like civilian casualties in the attack on Gaza. I'm just saying that those who support Hamas are not supporting freedom-loving, democracy-loving people.

From the 1988 Hamas Charter, Article 22:
With their money, they took control of the world media, news agencies, the press, publishing houses, broadcasting stations, and others. With their money they stirred revolutions in various parts of the world with the purpose of achieving their interests and reaping the fruit therein. They were behind the French Revolution, the Communist revolution and most of the revolutions we heard and hear about, here and there. With their money, they formed secret societies, such as Freemason, Rotary Clubs, the Lions and others in different parts of the world for the purpose of sabotaging societies and achieving Zionist interests. With their money they were able to control imperialistic countries and instigate them to colonize many countries in order to enable them to exploit their resources and spread corruption there.
Antisemitism is real. And it's been with us for longer than any of us have been alive.

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bpj
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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by bpj » Wed Nov 22, 2023 8:42 pm

Yes, anti-semitism is real!

But mostly because you people are racist against Arabs.

Jews aren't the only "semites" and their constant victim status has completely destroyed any value that term may have bought them.

Tell others to read a book but you don't even seem to understand that anti-semitism applies to Arabs also. They just don't cry victim all the time. Only when Israel is killing their people and stealing their land, actually...

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Re: Hamas Attack in Israel

Post by gil » Wed Nov 22, 2023 9:35 pm

bpj wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2023 8:42 pm
Yes, anti-semitism is real!

But mostly because you people are racist against Arabs.
"You people"? What does that mean?
Jews aren't the only "semites"
Your source below (i.e., the wikipedia screen capture you posted) says it's an "obsolete" term when applied to Arabs as well. Unless I misunderstand what "obsolete" means, antisemitism is anti-Jew.
and their constant victim status has completely destroyed any value that term may have bought them.

Tell others to read a book but you don't even seem to understand that anti-semitism applies to Arabs also. They just don't cry victim all the time. Only when Israel is killing their people and stealing their land, actually...

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