Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

User avatar
Donn Beach
Posts: 13261
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 1:06 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Donn Beach » Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:58 pm

D-train wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:29 pm
Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 8:20 am
So what's the answer?
The answer to school shooting is simple. One entry point with human security. All other doors considered emergency exits locked from the inside.
I'm not talking about schools, they are probably an anomaly in terms of the entire picture. But sure, make them fortresses, why not. What I am talking about is not getting shot with a gun. The logic that guns make us safer I find interesting. Guns do not make you safer, they just don't. If you want to own one go for it, but don't try and feed me the nonsense that you are then safer. It's much more likely you or a family member will be shot with your gun than harmed by an intruder, that's a fact. That's what I keep hearing, don't feel safe? The answer is more guns!

User avatar
Walla Walla Dawg II
Posts: 2355
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2021 12:29 am
Location: Southeastern Washington

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Walla Walla Dawg II » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:10 pm

Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:28 pm
The issue with gun violence goes further than schools, and yeah, the answer I always hear is to arm more people with guns. That's one of the real fallacies of guns. Being around someone who owns a gun does not make you safer, it only increases your chances of being shot with a gun
Wow, quoted by the left side of the isle, MSNBC, CNN, CBS, ABC & NBC.
You should be proud for falling in line.

There isn't an "eyeroll" big enough here to show my distain.

User avatar
Walla Walla Dawg II
Posts: 2355
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2021 12:29 am
Location: Southeastern Washington

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Walla Walla Dawg II » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:15 pm

Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:58 pm
D-train wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:29 pm
Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 8:20 am
So what's the answer?
The answer to school shooting is simple. One entry point with human security. All other doors considered emergency exits locked from the inside.
I'm not talking about schools, they are probably an anomaly in terms of the entire picture. But sure, make them fortresses, why not. What I am talking about is not getting shot with a gun. The logic that guns make us safer I find interesting. Guns do not make you safer, they just don't. If you want to own one go for it, but don't try and feed me the nonsense that you are then safer. It's much more likely you or a family member will be shot with your gun than harmed by an intruder, that's a fact. That's what I keep hearing, don't feel safe? The answer is more guns!
I dare you to watch it.
It's the data!!!

User avatar
Donn Beach
Posts: 13261
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 1:06 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Donn Beach » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:17 pm

Is that the best you can come up with? I haven't turned in to any of them I would say in at least 25 years. I haven't owned a television since then. If that's their angle then they must be quoting me. I'm not particularly against guns. I've owned them before. I just don't buy the nonsense that they make you safer, it's bullshit. You own a gun because it's cool, it's this amazing little piece of engineering that makes you feel powerful, but that's no being safer.

User avatar
Donn Beach
Posts: 13261
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 1:06 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Donn Beach » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:18 pm

Walla Walla Dawg II wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:15 pm
Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:58 pm
D-train wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:29 pm


The answer to school shooting is simple. One entry point with human security. All other doors considered emergency exits locked from the inside.
I'm not talking about schools, they are probably an anomaly in terms of the entire picture. But sure, make them fortresses, why not. What I am talking about is not getting shot with a gun. The logic that guns make us safer I find interesting. Guns do not make you safer, they just don't. If you want to own one go for it, but don't try and feed me the nonsense that you are then safer. It's much more likely you or a family member will be shot with your gun than harmed by an intruder, that's a fact. That's what I keep hearing, don't feel safe? The answer is more guns!
I dare you to watch it.
It's the data!!!
Watch what?

User avatar
Donn Beach
Posts: 13261
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 1:06 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Donn Beach » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:28 pm

I bet if schools had deputized staff it would be a massive deterrent for any mass shooter to hit a school. Those criminals might decide to try to hit a mall instead, but then they would be up against other CCW holders which is also a deterrent
That's it there, the possibility of being shot by a mall lunatic is probably infinitesimal. But the solution is to have everyone in the place armed, and that makes you feel safer. It doesn't occur to you the chances of say, getting shot over a disputed parking space rising to a much higher degree than the lunatic ever was. That's where the dangers are, situations like that, but let's protect ourselves from the lunatics... okay
https://www.google.com/search?q=shootin ... iz-hp#ip=1
Last edited by Donn Beach on Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
gil
Posts: 1443
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2020 1:50 pm

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by gil » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:31 pm

What do people think of this Scientific American article? ("The Science is Clear: Gun Control Saves Lives")

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... ves-lives/

I feel that "laws will prevent a mass shooting" is a ridiculous statement, but "laws will reduce the probability of mass shootings" is a testable hypothesis.

In the Scientific American article, the Editors argue for more research into safety from gun violence. They say the model is research into highway and vehicle safety, which has resulting in driving and roads being much safer than ever. But in fact, federal support for such gun research was non existent for 20 years (due to the Dickey Amendment).

Some of the research the Scientific American article cites has found:

1. "states with higher levels of firearm ownership have an increased risk for violent crimes perpetrated with a firearm" https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26091930/ ("As we previously reported, in 2015, assaults with a firearm were 6.8 times more common in states that had the most guns, compared to the least")

2. "More than a dozen studies have revealed that if you had a gun at home, you were twice as likely to be killed as someone who didn’t" https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326 ... id=1814426

3. "When Missouri repealed its permit law, gun-related killings increased by 25 percent." https://www.jhsph.edu/research/centers- ... licensing/

4. Regarding "a ban [on] people who are convicted of violent crime from buying a gun. In California, before the state passed such a law, people convicted of crimes were almost 30 percent more likely to be arrested again for a gun or violent crime than those who, after the law, couldn’t buy a gun." https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... shootings/

I'm an empirical person, and I believe in figuring out cause and effect relationships. Protecting 9 year olds shouldn't be the subject of partisan grandstanding and repeating the same old talking points.

User avatar
Cascade Kid
Posts: 874
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:11 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Cascade Kid » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:53 pm

Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:58 pm
D-train wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:29 pm
Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 8:20 am
So what's the answer?
The answer to school shooting is simple. One entry point with human security. All other doors considered emergency exits locked from the inside.
I'm not talking about schools, they are probably an anomaly in terms of the entire picture. But sure, make them fortresses, why not. What I am talking about is not getting shot with a gun. The logic that guns make us safer I find interesting. Guns do not make you safer, they just don't. If you want to own one go for it, but don't try and feed me the nonsense that you are then safer. It's much more likely you or a family member will be shot with your gun than harmed by an intruder, that's a fact. That's what I keep hearing, don't feel safe? The answer is more guns!
I'm sorry, the subject here isn't about the Nashville shooting? Well then please let me start by sharing with you that Jews having lived in 1938 Germany will disagree with you.

Here are some facts to consume...

Low-end defensive gun uses are estimated between 55,000 to 80,000 each year. High-end estimates are around 300,000 each year. There are also an estimated 400,000 to 500,000 guns in the US, so it would be impossible to get that cat back in the bag.

Anti-gun will always jump straight to gun bans on the less than genuine notion that it's about saving lives. But in reality it is about government control. Otherwise we'd see an investment in gun safety and training initiatives, but I don's see any government endorsed efforts on that front in any sort of media campaign.

Oh, some more food for thought... How about how our WA state legislation pats themselves on their backs by saying that our state has gone from a "grade C to a grade B on gun control, and aiming for a grade A" (quoted by rep Liz Berry(D)). But here are the results provided by the CDC up until 2020 (geez, wonder why they stopped tracking this important data and the CDC?...hmmm), and then from 2021 till now is provided by Washington State Homicide.

............Per capita/100,000.................................Total Homicides
2014..........3.1..................................................211
2015..........3.4..................................................239
2016..........2.9..................................................216
2017..........3.6..................................................266
2018..........3.7..................................................275
2019..........3.2..................................................241
I-1639 Enforcement started July 1, 2020
2020..........4.2..................................................322
2021..........No data............................................325
WA state standard capacity aka "high capacity" magazine ban July 2022
2022..........No data............................................379
2023 so far to date?..............................................84 On pace for another new record of 397

User avatar
Walla Walla Dawg II
Posts: 2355
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2021 12:29 am
Location: Southeastern Washington

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Walla Walla Dawg II » Thu Mar 30, 2023 5:15 pm

Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:18 pm
Walla Walla Dawg II wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:15 pm
Donn Beach wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2023 3:58 pm


I'm not talking about schools, they are probably an anomaly in terms of the entire picture. But sure, make them fortresses, why not. What I am talking about is not getting shot with a gun. The logic that guns make us safer I find interesting. Guns do not make you safer, they just don't. If you want to own one go for it, but don't try and feed me the nonsense that you are then safer. It's much more likely you or a family member will be shot with your gun than harmed by an intruder, that's a fact. That's what I keep hearing, don't feel safe? The answer is more guns!
I dare you to watch it.
It's the data!!!
Watch what?
I apologize, I thought I hit the link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuvDPG8pf_M

User avatar
Cascade Kid
Posts: 874
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2021 2:11 am

Re: Body cam footage of Nashville shooting

Post by Cascade Kid » Thu Mar 30, 2023 7:24 pm

maoling wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2023 8:43 pm
It's not that I'm blaming the tool. It's just that I think too many crazy fuckers have access to weapons that can kill an extraordinary number of persons in a matter of seconds.

And I agree about enforcing what's on the books already, In fact, I'd like to see a law where anyone using any gun, in the commission of any crime, whether the weapon is fired or not, to immediately get slapped with a mandatory prison term added if convicted. Like if a guy brandishes and threatens his ex -- five years, see ya. Or if some inner-city gang-banger is caught with gun while he is out threatening some rival homeboy on a drive-by, see ya. That doesn't stop a mass shooter, but if other assholes flat-out knew they were going to do significant hard time from the mere fact of waving a gun at someone, I'm all in.
I wholeheartly agree with you on convicting violent gun criminals and pressing strict prison sentences as this would act as a deterrent in >99% of shootings which excude the mass shooting standard. As for the 38 innocent souls killed in massing shootings in 2020 (CDC stat), maybe if we did have tougher sentencing, including well-regulated capital punishment, then perhaps these too could've been mitigated.

Post Reply