Adding contact, and doing it cheaply. Off Szn Plan 1.0

[MarinerFan4Life]

Just a thought, but it seems like everyone is evaluating players based on their playoff performance only and not looking at the full year body of work. I tend to agree we have plenty of power and need more OBP as home runs with no one on base is limiting. If we can get clear upgrades, great, but I don't think Randy Arozarena is the problem solely based on his poor playoff performance. In my mind, Canzone, Young, Suarez/Williamson are the open questions in the field. Look for bullpen upgrades. Try to explore trading Castillo to free up salary for more upgrades at our weak positions. And of course re-sign Naylor and Polanco. None of the above is exciting, but is a solid approach to the off season.

[D-train]

The irrational obsession with contact is bizarre here

I think people see Toronto putting it in play and believe that is why they are winning. They slug as well. Having a combination is what is needed. Think about the games the Mariners won in the Post Season, in comparison to the ones they lost. It sure felt like we hit a lot of Solo HRs in the games we lost. Draw a walk and get a blooper before? Changes the game. One of the Solo HRs that Cal hit came leading off the inning right after Julio bounced into a double play with two on. If it's just one out? That is a three run bomb instead of a Solo HR. So, in that instance? Was contact what was needed? A fly out or a strikeout would have resulted in Cal getting to bat. We of course can't guarantee that he hits a bomb, but....

Yes they slug as well. People love contact until guys hit into DPs and or a couple meaningless two out singles resulting in no runs happen.

[D-train]

Just a thought, but it seems like everyone is evaluating players based on their playoff performance only and not looking at the full year body of work. I tend to agree we have plenty of power and need more OBP as home runs with no one on base is limiting. If we can get clear upgrades, great, but I don't think Randy Arozarena is the problem solely based on his poor playoff performance. In my mind, Canzone, Young, Suarez/Williamson are the open questions in the field. Look for bullpen upgrades. Try to explore trading Castillo to free up salary for more upgrades at our weak positions. And of course re-sign Naylor and Polanco. None of the above is exciting, but is a solid approach to the off season.

We were 4th of 15 in the American League in OBP. But sure trade for noodle bat Kwan who isn't even rumored to be available so we can be awarded the Bronze medal for OBP next season.

[harmony]

Just a thought, but it seems like everyone is evaluating players based on their playoff performance only and not looking at the full year body of work. I tend to agree we have plenty of power and need more OBP as home runs with no one on base is limiting. If we can get clear upgrades, great, but I don't think Randy Arozarena is the problem solely based on his poor playoff performance. In my mind, Canzone, Young, Suarez/Williamson are the open questions in the field. Look for bullpen upgrades. Try to explore trading Castillo to free up salary for more upgrades at our weak positions. And of course re-sign Naylor and Polanco. None of the above is exciting, but is a solid approach to the off season.

An analysis of the free agent market for Jorge Polanco:

https://www.justbaseball.com/mlb/jorge- ... ree-agent/

[Michael K.]

We were 4th of 15 in the American League in OBP. But sure trade for noodle bat Kwan who isn't even rumored to be available so we can be awarded the Bronze medal for OBP next season.

And in the games we won in the playoffs? We had traffic on the basepaths. Guess what? That was true for Detroit and Toronto in the games they won also. I think that is where this is coming from....the teams that win in the playoffs get baserunners, and too many people are listening to the stooges in the booth that keep reminding everyone that Toronto is "making contact". The Blue Jays have played 16 games this post season. They have 27 HRs and 29 Doubles. 58 of their 168 hits are for extra bases. They aren't up there swinging to contact.

[HawkandMariner88]

So what is DT's & Michael's approach. You got your power guys in Julio & Cal. Is it the player or the approach. Naylor gets on. What is the best strategy here. You not gonna have all 9 contact or all 9 power guys. Yes put it in play. I guess I don't understand your guys approach. Toronto was nowhere close to the top in HR's so how are they winning. Maybe doing the little things. Double then bunt. Nobody wants to bunt it's not sexy. Your 1 & 2 set the table for your power guys 3-4-5. What exactly is Toronto doing that's so effective. Last night both HR's were solo same as we do. No different.

HR by game

Yesterday - 2 (Vlad & Schneider solo)

Game 4 - 1 (Vlad 2 run)

Game 3 - 1 (Kirk 3 run)

Game 2 - 0

Game 1 - 3 (Varsho 2 run, Barger Grand Slam, Kirk 2 run)

So out of 5 games they've hit a grand total of 6 HR. Out of those 6 only 2 were solo shots. Is that the correlation your trying to make. Are solo HR still good, yes. They also added on to that something we were unable to do. Point being you have to have balance. Play a complete offensive game all around. I think that's what you guys are trying to get at. You can't be one extreme or the other. Not every Jays hitter is trying to knock it out of the park. They know their role. In 5 games they've managed to outscore the Dodgers 29-18. In their 3 wins they've held the Dodgers to 4 runs or less. So looking at this I say are they doing the same thing we did, no. Still gotta grind out at bats. Do we have the pieces to do what they did, probably. What do they have that we don't. Is it more approach or is the players? Their best power hitter is Vlad. We have Cal & Julio. What else is different about what they have.

[Michael K.]

I think some of what you see with Toronto, in saying they were "nowhere near the top in HRs" is misleading. Vlad hit 23. Does he strike you as a 23 HR guy? Their best OB guy was Springer, who also lead the team with 32 HRs. So? Obviously it's possible to hit for power and get on base. Some of that is an approach. I feel like every hitter we have gets up there and swings from their ass, regardless of the count or the situation. It's odd. But saying they just need to add punch and judy on base guys and all is solved is silly. They need the guys that aren't going to hit a ton of HRs to finally realize that. Do you watch JP swing a bat and think he looks like he realizes he is a guy that in the last five full seasons averages 11 HRs a year? Because I don't....he swings the bat like he thinks he hits 55 a year, not 55 over five years.

[HawkandMariner88]

So it's the approach then. How do you fix it then?

[bhofferb]

Sad that most of the plans end up with the Mariners going downhill position-wise at several positions.
Suarez>Williamson
Polanco>Young, Rivas, Bliss or whoever
Naylor>Whoever they think can replace him
etc.

What it comes down to is that unless Stanton and Jerry want to make the team better by spending so money or by trading prospects for proven talent that can help them win now, the Mariners are likely to sink back into the middle of the pack. But the M's made money this year, so we are supposed to live the next 20 years reliving the glory days of 2025...

[Seattle or Bust]

I'm not obsessed with contact, but contact is what this offense lacked in the playoffs.

The Jays put a ton of pressure on us with constant baserunners and eventually cashed in. We went 5-6 innings at a time without a baserunner in some games and hoped a homer would save us.

My plan is adding Donovan to the fold instead of Geno and Yandy Diaz instead Garver/whatever the fuck else we threw out there last season... I don't think anyone can argue that if the M's make the moves I suggest (yes, small chance) they'd be the runaway favorites in the AL West, if not the AL, heading into next year. And they're not totally out of the realm of possibility given who may be available and rumored finances.