Virus Schmirus

[Double Mocha Man]

That's true. (It was nice of me to clean up my yard for my neighbors, but not "essential.") I've heard from other people that they have run into non-mask-wearers in grocery stores and hardware stores. People in my grocery store have been good.

Stores won't let you in without one here. I don't have a problem with that at all. My issue is having to wear one out side in public places when you can EASILY social distance.

DT... you need to move back to WA. They let you social distance outside without a mask...

[Moe Gibbs]

Guessing that is exception rather than the rule. I wear a mask when it makes sense to do so and I don't when it doesn't and I don't cough on people. I think most sane people have the same policy. Nice google search to find that one example out of a million though.

You seem like a solid human being and I'd trust you to protect other by wearing a mask when appropriate. I just worry about the people who fall outside the boundaries of "most sane people." I think someone else mentioned, aren't the anti-mask sentiments largely about not being forced to wear them, no matter what the circumstances? (i.e., they are not arguing for "reasonable" mask wearing, they are arguing that force masked wearing violates their rights).

The other day I went to a free recycling event (scrap metal, stuff like that) at my local Lutheran Church, and about 25 people were working the event. I only saw one guy working who was without a mask, but about 1/2 of them had their masks pulled down around their necks or up on their heads. This included the guy who stuck his head next to my open window to give me instructions on where to drop off my stuff. One woman who was working kept her mask on, until she wanted to speak, then she pulled it down. The mask went back on when she stopped talking. "Most sane people" apparently leaves out a few of us.

Also, aren't rules kept simple and strict so they aren't open to interpretation? If I stop and then drive straight through a red light at 3am with no one around, I'm still committing an offense, right? If I'm very careful and completely sober and awake, no one is in danger, but I sure would not do this if I saw a cop in the area!

When are you going to feel safe about not wearing your mask..?
When [[[THOSE WHO OWN THE MEDIA]]] tell you..?
When the Official Death count reaches absolute dead fucking zero for a year...?

[Donn Beach]

course they had the same situation in 1918

Cities that passed masking ordinances in the fall of 1918 struggled to enforce them among the small portion of people who rebelled. Common punishments were fines, prison sentences and having your name printed in the paper. In one horrific incident in San Francisco, a special officer for the board of health shot a man who refused to wear a mask as well as two bystanders.

[D-train]

That's true. (It was nice of me to clean up my yard for my neighbors, but not "essential.") I've heard from other people that they have run into non-mask-wearers in grocery stores and hardware stores. People in my grocery store have been good.

Stores won't let you in without one here. I don't have a problem with that at all. My issue is having to wear one out side in public places when you can EASILY social distance.

DT... you need to move back to WA. They let you social distance outside without a mask...

I do that here. About half the people have the sense to do the same. The rest are apparently brainwashed or enjoy not showing their entire face in public.

[Sibelius Hindemith]

On the effectiveness of cloth masks....

The widespread use of cloth masks by healthcare workers may actually put them at increased risk of respiratory illness and viral infections and their global use should be discouraged, according to a UNSW study....
....
The authors speculate that the cloth masks' moisture retention, their reuse and poor filtration may explain the increased risk of infection.
...
Professor MacIntyre said the study's results pointed to the effectiveness of medical masks, in addition to the harm caused by cloth masks.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 121724.htm
The full study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4420971/

The vast majority of people I see wearing masks are wearing cloth masks, not surgical masks. Why, with this information available for 5 years don't the governors and media pundits pushing for everyone to wear masks not stipulate that masks that actually might help be worn? I have been using only surgical masks and even those don't form a very good seal around the borders.

More on the use of masks from some experts in the field...

Dr Chris Smith, consultant virologist at Cambridge University, told RNZ people should not buy them and instead save their money.

"Go and spend it on something useful that you enjoy doing, like having a beer. Those face masks are absolute rubbish and they do nothing."
However, he did say they had a placebo effect.

"They make you feel better, that you've done something, and they also have the effect of warning you to stay away from someone who's wearing one."

He said whether a virus could get through a face mask depended on the type of mask.

"The ones we're talking about, that you go and buy off a street vendor and you wear on the underground or tram or on the streets - those are absolutely useless. If you are in hospital and you are fit-tested for a proper prophylactic mask, those do work. And the reason they work is they form a proper seal around your face and around you nose and mouth and you also wear eye protection, and they also have very stringent filtering as well.

"The ones that you buy on the street that are cheap and nasty ... there are big gaps around the sides of your face and every time you cough and sneeze it just comes flying out the side.

"Also they dampen, so as you breathe they get damp and that dampness just makes a nice conduit through for the virus particles."

.....

Dr Jake Dunning, head of emerging infections and zoonoses at Public Health England, said: "Although there is a perception that the wearing of facemasks may be beneficial, there is in fact very little evidence of widespread benefit from their use outside of these clinical setting."

He said masks had to be worn correctly, changed frequently and got rid of safely if they were to work properly.

"Research also shows that compliance with these recommended behaviours reduces over time when wearing facemasks for prolonged periods," he added.

People would be better to focus on good personal and hand hygiene if they are concerned, Dr Dunning said.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/408 ... virologist

Another doctor/lawyer weighs in....

The Covid virus was supposed to be contained in the kind of lab where people wear astronaut suits and go through triple sealed doors. It is a con of massive proportion to assert that now, having escaped those environs, a bandana will magically do the trick.

After all, size matters.

The pore size of cloth face coverings range from ~ 20-100 microns. The Covid virus is 200-1000x smaller than that, at 0.1 microns. Putting up a chain link fence will not keep out a mosquito. Even the most esteemed medical journals admit their purpose is to calm anxiety. “Expanded masking protocols’ greatest contribution may be to reduce the transmission of anxiety …”

Of course, by knowledge or common sense observation, most Americans already know that masking everyone is superstition. But unlike privately carrying a lucky charm, mandating facial coverings requires the consent of the governed.
....
Not wearing a mask is not mere “personal choice” like deciding between a head covering or a t-shirt. It is a flashpoint for being a free human being who has consented to be governed but has not consented to be ruled. We do not consent to a masked America, because that is a fundamental change in American society, culture, norms, and rights.

https://themichiganstar.com/2020/06/29/ ... t-consent/

More from the same doctor...

Dr. Simone Gold, an emergency medicine specialist based in Los Angeles, told “America’s Newsroom” on Thursday that “there are thousands and thousands of stories of patient harm” due to stay-at-home orders issued in response to the coronavirus pandemic.

“We are frustrated,” Gold, the head organizer of the letter, told host Ed Henry.

Gold is the head organizer of an open letter signed by more than 600 doctors who pushed President Trump to end what they called a "national shutdown". The letter described widespread state orders keeping businesses closed and children home from school as a "mass casualty incident" with "exponentially growing health consequences."

The letter said that as a result of the shutdowns, doctors have seen increases in the number of patients missing routine checkups that could detect issues like heart problems or cancer, increased substance and alcohol abuse, and greater financial instability that could lead to "[p]overty and financial uncertainty," which "is closely linked to poor health."

https://www.foxnews.com/media/dr-simone ... s-shutdown

More on the letter from 600 physicians...

More than 600 of the nation’s physicians sent a letter to President Trump this week calling the coronavirus shutdowns a “mass casualty incident” with “exponentially growing negative health consequences” to millions of non COVID patients.

“The downstream health effects...are being massively under-estimated and under-reported. This is an order of magnitude error," according to the letter initiated by Simone Gold, M.D., an emergency medicine specialist in Los Angeles.

“Suicide hotline phone calls have increased 600%,” the letter said. Other silent casualties: “150,000 Americans per month who would have had new cancer detected through routine screening.”

From missed cancer diagnoses to untreated heart attacks and strokes to increased risks of suicides, “We are alarmed at what appears to be a lack of consideration for the future health of our patients.”

.....

NPR reported about a Washington state resident who had what she described as the “worst headache of her life.”

She waited almost a week before going to the hospital where doctors discovered she had a brain bleed that had gone untreated. She had multiple strokes and died. “This is something that most of the time we're able to prevent,” said her neurosurgeon, Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary, director of the Overlake Neuroscience Institute in Bellevue, Wash.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gracemarie ... a99d8150fa

[D-train]

Ot saw a great free movie last night.

The Man Who Wasnt There
Theatrical release poster
Directed by Joel Coen
Produced by Ethan Coen
Written by
Joel Coen
Ethan Coen
Starring
Billy Bob Thornton
Frances McDormand
Michael Badalucco
Richard Jenkins
Scarlett Johansson

The Man Who Wasn't There is a 2001 crime film written, produced and directed by Joel and Ethan Coen. Billy Bob Thornton stars in the title role. Also featured are Tony Shalhoub, Scarlett Johansson, James Gandolfini, and Coen regulars Frances McDormand, Michael Badalucco, Richard Jenkins and Jon Polito. Joel Coen won the Best Director Award at the 2001 Cannes Film Festival, sharing the prize with David Lynch for Mulholland Drive. Ethan Coen, Joel Coen's brother and co-director of the film, did not receive the Best Director Award as he was not credited as a director.

A 17 yo Scarlett Johansson was well worth the price of admission.

[D-train]

I have always assumed this:

The pore size of cloth face coverings range from ~ 20-100 microns. The Covid virus is 200-1000x smaller than that, at 0.1 microns. Putting up a chain link fence will not keep out a mosquito. Even the most esteemed medical journals admit their purpose is to calm anxiety. “Expanded masking protocols’ greatest contribution may be to reduce the transmission of anxiety …”

Ironically thousands have probably been infected due to a false sense of security that they can do anything safely as long as they have a mask on. Even breaking the last and destroy fellow citizens property and lives.

[Sibelius Hindemith]

Sure, the mainstream media helps to creates anxiety and the masks are then needed to reduce it without really making people any safer.

[gil]

Guessing that is exception rather than the rule. I wear a mask when it makes sense to do so and I don't when it doesn't and I don't cough on people. I think most sane people have the same policy. Nice google search to find that one example out of a million though.

You seem like a solid human being and I'd trust you to protect other by wearing a mask when appropriate. I just worry about the people who fall outside the boundaries of "most sane people." I think someone else mentioned, aren't the anti-mask sentiments largely about not being forced to wear them, no matter what the circumstances? (i.e., they are not arguing for "reasonable" mask wearing, they are arguing that force masked wearing violates their rights).

The other day I went to a free recycling event (scrap metal, stuff like that) at my local Lutheran Church, and about 25 people were working the event. I only saw one guy working who was without a mask, but about 1/2 of them had their masks pulled down around their necks or up on their heads. This included the guy who stuck his head next to my open window to give me instructions on where to drop off my stuff. One woman who was working kept her mask on, until she wanted to speak, then she pulled it down. The mask went back on when she stopped talking. "Most sane people" apparently leaves out a few of us.

Also, aren't rules kept simple and strict so they aren't open to interpretation? If I stop and then drive straight through a red light at 3am with no one around, I'm still committing an offense, right? If I'm very careful and completely sober and awake, no one is in danger, but I sure would not do this if I saw a cop in the area!

When are you going to feel safe about not wearing your mask..?
When [[[THOSE WHO OWN THE MEDIA]]] tell you..?
When the Official Death count reaches absolute dead fucking zero for a year...?

I don't feel that my wearing a cloth mask protects ME very much. But if I sneeze or cough, it catches some of the aerosol (and certainly larger droplets). As someone wrote, the virus particles are MUCH smaller than the openings in cloth. But if the virus is riding on droplets that get caught in the mask, then it's done its job. My hope is that people feel safer, not more worried, when they see me (and hopefully most others) wearing a mask when social distancing is not possible. I'll stop when the best health advice from the experts says we don't need them.

[gil]

I kind of remember (was it March?) some discussion of why the "blue states" had the most cases. Quick update on the percentage increase in the past two weeks (I am collecting data from worldometers.info)

The 5 states with the largest percentage increase in cases from June 15 to June 29:

Arizona 107.1%
Florida 86.7%
South Carolina 77.3%
Texas 71.6%
Arkansas 58.5%

(Followed by Oklahoma, Idaho, Nevada, and Oregon, all with increases of more than 50% in the past two weeks)

The 5 states with the smallest percentage increase in cases from June 15 to June 29:

Massachusetts 1.5% (keep up the great work, dt!)
Connecticut 2.7%
New York 3.0%
New Jersey 4.1%
Rhode Island 4.5%
District of Columbia 4.6% (yes I know that is #6, but it's so close)

Nationally, there has been a 21.9% increase in the past 2 weeks. In Washington, the increase is 23.0%. In King County, 14.0%.